captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions >> woodruff: technology giants, lead by google and microsoft, call for limits on the scope of government spying. good evening, i'm judy woodruff. >> ifill: and i'm gwen ifill. also ahead, how islamist fighters in syria are taking the lead, but also splintering the fight to topple the assad regime. >> woodruff: and, rock legend carlos santana, on a life of music and inspiration. >> real musicians remind the listener of a forgotten song inside them and when you hear that forgotten song you know you get chills, you get tears, you dance and didn't even know why.

>> woodruff: those are just some of the stories we're covering on tonight's "pbs newshour." >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> and by the alfred p. sloan foundation. supporting science, technology, and improved economic performance and financial literacy in the 21st century. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions and foundations. and... >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> ifill: the deal creating the world's largest airline became

official today. american airlines emerged from bankruptcy to join with u.s. airways. the new carrier will operate under the american airlines name. the merger leaves four airlines controlling more than 80% of the american travel market. passengers won't see immediate changes to reservations or frequent flyer programs, and it remains unclear if the deal will mean higher fares. eight of the most prominent u.s. tech companies, including apple, google and facebook, are calling for tighter controls on government surveillance. they sent an open letter to president obama today, in the wake of revelationshat the government collects personal data from their networks. we'll hear from microsoft, on what's driving the companies' concerns, right after the news summary. an icy, snowy mix made its way into new england today after leaving a messy trail in its wake. ice brought down power lines from texas to tennessee to virginia, and commuters faced hazardous driving this morning.

air travel was also a big problem, with another 1,600 flights canceled today. people were stranded all over the country. >> last night the lines for customer service, you couldn't see the end of them. and they were handing out pieces of paper saying call this number. you call the number and all circuits busy. it was just a nightmare. >> ifill: in all, there've been 6,100 flights canceled nationwide since saturday and hundreds more delayed. eight northeast and mid-atlantic states asked today for new federal curbs on air pollution created by their neighbors. they want nine southern and midwestern states to regulate power plant emissions that are carried northeast by prevailing winds. the supreme court hears arguments tomorrow in a related case involving 28 states. south africa made ready today for a mass memorial service honoring nelson mandela. at least 100,000 people, including nearly 100 world leaders, are expected to attend tomorrow. president obama and mrs. obama left washington this morning, joined on air force one by

former president george w. bush and his wife. former presidents clinton and carter also will attend. there's been more unrest in the central african republic, as gunmen refuse to give up their weapons to french troops. the french patrolled the capital city today, trying to disarm rival muslim and christian fighters who killed 400 people over the weekend. we'll have a report from the c.a.r. later in the program. the prime minister of thailand called for new elections today, in the face of protests against her rule. the opposition has accused her of corruption, insisting again she must go. john sparks of "independent television news" reports from bangkok. >> reporter: protest leaders called it the day of reckoning. a time to do-or-die. when their call was answered on the streets of bangkok by more than 150,000 people. and each one seemed determined to topple the thai government.

>> we've got to get them out. we're playing our last card. >> reporter: they've been at it for weeks. a rolling protest against the government of prime minister yingluck shinawatra. with demonstrators converging on government headquarters this morning, the thai prime minister made a surprise announcement. she disolved the government. >> miss yingluck who sounded shaken said let the people decide who governs next. back on the streets, the prime minister's big declaration had little impact. many here don't want elections. they want something completely different. the leader of these protests wasn't taking questions this morning. he was surrounded by a fall ang of bodyguards. his name is sutek and the silver haired politician

wants to replace the government with a nonelected body of experts. later he held court in front of a massive crowd. this his daily address. and he said they would need three extra days to take power. but the protestors have a problem. they don't represent the majority in thailand. if the elections take place, yingluck will almost certainly win. there seems no easy resolution to all this. and the battle for power will go on. in ukraine, there were signs of a possible crackdown, one day after hundreds of thousands of people protested against the government. riot troops stormed an opposition party office in kiev today, and police also tore down banners and tents blocking city offices. we'll talk to a correspondent on the ground in ukraine, later in the program. north korean leader kim jung un has expelled the country's second most powerful figure, his uncle, from the ruling circle.

state t.v. broadcast images sunday, that showed uniformed guards taking 67-year-old jang song thaek into custody. the unusually public purge happened at a party meeting. jang is charged with corruption, womanizing and abusing alcohol and drugs. 18 current and former los angeles county sheriff's deputies face federal charges in a civil rights and corruption case. the announcement today alleged beatings of inmates and jail visitors, unjustified detentions and conspiracy to obstruct a federal investigation. the probe focuses on the county jail system, the nation's largest. princeton university began immunizing nearly 6,000 students today against "type b" meningitis. the outbreak was deemed so serious that the food and drug administration authorized use of a vaccine not licensed in the u.s. since march, eight people at princeton have been stricken by

the potentially fatal disease. it's spread through kissing, coughing and other contact. the federal bailout of general motors is officially over. the treasury sold its remaining shares in the automaker today. in the end, the net cost to taxpayers was $10.5 billion. and on wall street today, the dow jones industrial average gained five points to close at 16,025. the nasdaq rose six points to close at 4,068. >> ifill: still to come on the "newshour": tech giants call for limits on spying; disarming rebels in the central african republic; unrest escalates in ukraine; islamists complicate the civil war in syria; the president of spelman college and rock legend carlos santana. >> woodruff: the giants of the tech industry made a highly public appeal today to rein in government surveillance. it came in the form of an open letter to president obama.

the call for curbs focused on people's personal information being collected from online traffic. eight major companies, including apple, facebook, google, microsoft and twitter, banded together to write an open letter to the president and congress. it appeared in full-page newspaper ads and online. the letter read in part: it's the tech giants' latest bid to salvage public trust, amid revelations that they've had to provide users' data to the government. the details come from edward snowden, who leaked a trove of material from the national security agency last summer. intelligence officials maintain the data collection operation

has thwarted a number of terror attacks. a presidential advisory panel has been reviewing the issue. its findings could come this week. we hear now from the tech world. brad smith is the general counsel and an executive vice president of microsoft. he's also speaking on behalf of the companies that signed today's letter. >> brad smith, welcome to the program. what is it that the government is doing that microsoft and the other companies want them to stop? well, throughout our industry we're concerned about the increasing reports that government surveillance including in the u.s. but also elsewhere has gone beyond what people understood. we see a need for reform. and specifically we're hoping that there will be clear legal rules, all of this should take place pursuant to the law there should be stronger executive oversight there needs to be enhanced review by the

courts. and there needs to be a bit more transparency, certainly, so that we can all have the confidence in the public that we live in a safe country. but also one where we know enough about what the government is doing to be confident that people are striking the right balance. >> isn't it the case that the tech companies, though, have been providing data to the government? >> well, for many years, we have been responding to subpoenas, to warrants, to court orders. we, of course, know what we have been doing. but frankly, what really surprised people across the tech sector was at the end of october, "the washington post" reported that beyond these legal processes, there were government evidents to infect collect data. in this instance it was data moving between the data centers within yahoo! and within google. and that wasn't within the confines of any legal process that anybody was aware of. and that shent a shockwave throughout the industry.

>> i've been reading today what some of the privacy advocates say. and a couple of them point out that it is because tech companies like microsoft and the others collect so much personal data yourselves that that is what makes it attractive for the government. that they wouldn't be-- in other words, trying to come after this data if you and the other companies didn't have it. >> well, there's a piece of this that may involve data that companies are collecting. but the reality is frankly most things turn on e-mails, text messages, web sites that people are visiting. you know, people do send a lot. they share a lot. they want to do that. and that is important in the context of government investigationsment but i would actually say that more than anything else is what started it to focus government investigators on this set of issues over a decade ago. >> have the companies tried to talk to the government

privately about this? because you're launching this big public campaign today. we know the white house, the president has said he's had a task force out, i guess, studying it. and it looks like they're going to be making some recommendations, have you made an attempt to settle this behind the scenes? >> well there have been a lot of discussions. and we appreciate the degree to which people in the government are listening. we know that president obama is thinking about this. we know that leaders in other countries are as well. but it's an issue of broad importance importance to the public. everybody should be concerned about the balance being struck between protecting safety on the one hand which with is obviously important. and protecting our fundamental freedoms and rights to privacy as well. so as important as private discussions are, this is too important to leave to private discussion alone. >> and i also see that the companies are trying to expand your own encryption to make it harder for

outsiders to come in and scoop up or take what you have. tell us a little bit about that. >> certainly we realized as an industry that there are more governments. this is not confined to any single country, that are seeking to hack their way or tap into cables and collect data so here at microsoft but really across our industry, companies increasingly are taking steps. increasing encryption that puts everything in code when it's going across the cable, for example, so the government cannot read, necessarily what it might be getting. we're increasing the ability of governments and others, customers to just knows what's going on because we understand that people do have a need to know. we're increasing local protections for our customers. we're really striving to take a comprehensive approach to insurance that the public can trust the technology they use in their every day lives. >> well, and you touch on a question, i think, that a

lot of people have. to some extent the government needs access to communications that may be involved in-- involved in or creating a threat to security. how do you and the companies know how to strike that balance? >> i think the most important question is who should strike the balance between public safety on the one hand and personal freedoms on the other. as soon as you can that question you realize that in any kind of democratic society it should be the government itself. we need clear laws. we need the kind of transparency so the public knows how these laws are being applied. we need to recognize that as important as public safety clearly is, we also have important constitutional freedoms, the right to speak, the right to be secure from unreasonable government searches. all of which are at stake. this is a matter for the public at large to decide through our elective

processes. >> woodruff: brad smith with microsoft, thank you very much. >> thank you. for the record we have asked the national security agency for an interview. we hope to hear from nsa officials at a later time. now, to the central african republic where french troops have begun disarming rival muslim and christian groups. alex thomson of independent television news was with french forces earlier today in the country's capital bangui. he filed this report. >> reporter: now it's for real on the streets of the capital. disarming the seleka militias, the number one objective says the french military commander. from dawn they set about it. on the ground, on the ground. one pistol and some cartridges off the streets. but these men were eventually allowed to go free.

it is the law of diminishing returns. the word soon gets around amongst the militia that the french are here and they avoid the area. what they're basically doing is letting the small fry go but anybody they consider important will be arrested. and so far there've been scores of those this morning. elsewhere, emboldened by the french being here christian mobs now out on the streets, looting anything they can from muslim shops and businesses. in another location the christian mob attacks a man and his teenage son suspected of being former seleka soldiers. the french troops try to intervene but the selaka haven't gone. this is a known seleka vehicle. the men are known as such. they're heading straight for a french checkpoint. cool and confident, moments later they came back. civilian clothing, no weapons,

no problem. the crowds looking on know what's happening. >> ( translated ): i really want the french to help us. to get out on the ground because there's nobody there. everything's looted. i'm a victim myself. >> ( translated ): he said it's for the french to get the militia's weapons from the mosques, from their homes and from the cemetery where they are hiding them. >> reporter: but the french can't be everywhere. in reality, they can hardly be anywhere but this is progress. 24 hours ago we were on the streets with french paratroopers. hot, tense an encounter between the paratroopers and the seleka militia usually drunk and stoned or both all but inevitable. they came upon this group of

seleka militia. neither side said anything or made any gesture. but the seleka armed and in uniform on the streets of the capital seem to have disappeared one day on. leaving a terrible stain on this capital, yet more people out this morning to bury their relatives. a man tells us how the seleka took his two brothers and beat them to death. >> ( translated ): what we're seeing is that the french troops are not in the hot spots, for instance around camp where they are killing people. there's no one there. they can do what they want over there. >> reporter: around the middle of the day a rainstorm built up over bangui, minutes later we found ourselves surrounded by this, what was until recently one of the cities monasteries and grounds now a vast chaotic camp of terrified christians, still refusing to go home french

army or no french army. he told us they aren't going home because a kind of psychosis has set in. only yesterday we had shooting in this district so even more came. it's just not in people's interest to leave here. can you blame them? a man carefully describes how his neighbors were hacked and shot to death. five of them. he's got all the closeups to prove it, which we couldn't possibly broadcast as they buried what had been the family next door. to say the french and african peacekeepers have their work cut out is an understatement in a city of looted baazars. at least 50,000 homeless, militias unlikely to go quietly. >> ifill: the president of the ukraine viktor yanukovich is

backing a call for talks with the country's opposition, in an attempt to quell weeks of protests. tensions are running high in kiev tonight, however, as pro- europe demonstrators are barricading protest camps which police have threatened to disperse. on sunday, a party-like atmosphere prevailed in the ukrainian capital, kiev. several hundred thousand people- - angry over what they see as the government's tilt toward russia and away from europe-- demanded the government's resignation. it was the largest crowd yet. the night ended with protesters pulling down a statue of vladimir lenin. today, signs of a new crackdown appeared. riot troops encircled some camp sites, and eventually began dismantling protesters' barricades. opposition leaders warned their followers not to provoke the police. >> ( translated ): in any case,

don't touch the police, don't beat them. if they destroy our camps, we'll go for new barricades and set them up tomorrow. >> ifill: elsewhere, masked men armed with guns raided the party headquarters of a jailed opposition leader, yulia tymoshenko. and, a state prosecutor warned protest leaders they face arrest. >> ( translated ): the calls of rally organizers show total disrespect to law and a desire to satisfy their political ambitions for any price. but particular politicians, when but it won't work. if they ignore the enforcement of judges' verdicts, disrespect the law and the constitution of ukraine, they'll be held responsible. >> ifill: president viktor yanukovich announced he'll meet with his predecessors tomorrow to discuss the crisis. for more on the latest developments we turn to a reporter covering the unrest in ukraine, david herszenhorn, moscow bureau chief for the "new york times." he's in kiev tonight. i spoke with him a short while ago. >> david t was a pretty vigorous government mushback today z that calm the protest at all.

>> no, things have gotten quite ominous here. things are very tense, police have surrounded many of the encampments that the exuberant protests established throughout the government quarter sunday night, after the huge ral eve hundreds of thousands of people. there are a lot of questions where this goes from here. protestors are bracing for a crackdown. we see a lot of diplomatic maneuvering happening now behind the scenes. >> ifill: we have heard a lot about the demands of prot testers that the government will resign, i'm assuming there is no sign of it. >> that is no end did-- indication. the president said he would talk with the three pred certificateses of ukraine to discuss what might be a way forward here. as part of that he seemed to create an opening for talks with protest leaders but closed that quite quickly as security forces raided the headquarters of one of the main opposition parties. they've announced an investigation into possible tro son charges. again the police have moved in to formation throughout the city. all sending some very dark

signals about where things are headed. >> the u.s. role, you talk about diplomatic maneuvering, what is -- in trying to urge the ukraine back to the eu. >> we saw quite a bit of discussion. the joe biden urged him not town leash force on the demonstrators. we saw how badly things went when there was a police crackdown on independence square on november 30th. the assistant secretary of state was in moscow pleading with kremlin officials to help bring this situation to some sort of solution to help ukraine find a path back to getting economic aid package that it needs from the international monitor fund. of course russia is keen on minute takening its influence here. they are said to be preparing their own rescue package. but none of that seems possible as long as there are thousands of protestors and thousands of ryeout police massing on the streets. >> ifill: is there anyone in a position to broker some sort of an agreement? >> not right now. it seems until this unrest

sets we're well into the third week of this widening civil disturbance here, until that calls down, it doesn't seem that any solution is possible. and the question becomes what are the protestors willing to accept. as you said, they demanded the resignation of the government. they would like to see some arrested protestors released but there is no sign on mr. yanukovich's side that he is willing to step down or fire the prime minister and the rest of the cabinet. so we are really at a stand still waiting to see where things turn. >> ifill: is there any hope to be found in these proposed round table caulks? >> well, again, it's hard to see how they talk when the party headquarters of fatherland, this is the party of tymoshenko, the former prime minister today, the computer services were taken out, it is very hard to fit a round table in square jail cell and complained today that really the government is not taking

necessary steps to make talks like that fruitful and possible. >> ifill: a bleak and snowy night in kiev, david horzen horn thank you for join ug us. >> woodruff: now to another area of conflict, syria, where the uprising has reached its 1,000th day. recently, chief foreign affairs correspondent margaret warner reported on disarray among the western-backed rebels. tonight, she looks at the islamist fighters who are gaining traction, through the eyes of a journalist with unusual access to the al qaeda- linked groups. >> for more than a year the border crossing from turkey, a vital lifeline for syria's rebels was controlled by the anti-assad free syrian army. but saturday a newly formed alliance of islamist rebels

calling itself the islamic front took charge. it was the latest blow to the moderate forces backed by the u.s. which in initially lead the armed insurgency arising from sir why's 2011 civilian protests. as the civil war has ground on, radicallization among native syrian rebels has grown. and the conflict has attracted foreign jihadist fighters from throughout the arab and muslim world. so rather than a coherent force opposing assad, there is an array of rebel groups on the moderate to extremist spectrum. the free syrian army or fsa, the new islamic front including islamist groups once allied with the fsa. the al qaeda link zurdian grown al nice ra and its al qaeda iraqi parent the islamic state of iraq and al sham. among the few western journalists who have had access to report in depth on these groups has been rania

abouzeid, now a contributor to the "new yorker" magazine. i spoke with her friday in washington. rania, thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> you have been up close reporting on a couple of these major rebel groups, both the moderate free syrian army that the u.s. backs and also some of the al qaeda linked forces. why do you think the al qaeda-linked forces have gained the ascendancy? >> well, there are two al qaeda affiliates, the islamic state of iraq and al sham, the, and the other one al nousra, and that tends to be more syrian. it has sir yen leadership. the other one has iraqi leadership. >> and the kinds of fighters that are attracted to al nou ask ra to the free syrian army, how different. >> they have a more religious hugh, more religious tilt. they're also attracted to jab at al nous ra because it seems to be more of a status symbol to be accepted

because they are very schrektive in terms of who they take. and they have discipline which is something that the other free syrian army units often lack. >> and how different are they in their ideology. >> well, even some groups that identify themselves as free syrian army are islamists and they also want an islamic state. so you know, it's a very sort of blurry picture. and this picture of islamism if you like within the syrian armed deposition. >> tell us about your own personal encounters. you crossed into syria and you went to see, i think you called him a sharia law officer with al nousra near aleppo. >> they were very cloak-and-dagger. i krosd the border. he told me to meet a particular man. hi heat him b i asked for him. we were in a car. wendted up on this abandoned road and there was only another vehicle there. a guy way black scarf over his face was actually wearing a balaclava but his

face was covered just opened the back door, got in, didn't say a word. he didn't even identify himself. and i had to ask him, are you -- >> did you feel safe? >> that sounds like a classic sort of journalist kidnapping scene. >> i did, because i knew who had sent me, who had been the intermediary, i trusted the intermediary. >> now given-- given their views about the west, western media and women, how did you-- how do you think you got them to trust you? >> well, you know, i've been covering syria since it started. you know, i still have to get somebody to sort of vouch for me. because the acquisition of spy flies around very easily, it still flies around so often is familiarity with my work and what i'm doing and just physically that i'm in these places that i'm in. >> how do they treat you as a woman. >> sometimes there are small telling things. like i was once climbing a hill with an islamist

fighter and i needed a little bit of help, i'm not the fittest person. rather than extend his hand he extended the barrel of his weapon, because as a conservative muslim he wouldn't touch the hand of a woman who was not a close relative. >> there is a very-- there's a clear distinction between the foreign members of al nousra and the syrian members. i can fit with the syrian member, they will sit with me, they will look me in the eye and we can have a conversation. the foreigners won't look at me. if they talk to me, they will turn tear back to me or turn to the side. and they're much, much more conservative. >> you mentioned this one pro vention capitol that has fallen up to the rebels. al news ra was the spearhead of the force that went in there, one of them. how are they governing. >> a couple of weeks after it fell, they were one of about, i think there were about half a dozen islamist groups that were ruling the

city. and you know, they had men posted outside the two churches, for example. they had -- >> to preserve them. >> to preserve them, nobody touch the churches. a few months over that the islamic state of iraq and al sham came to be the ruler, the they desecrated the churches. and so very, very different sort of approach to governance. >> so you are seeing a growing radicallization or growing ascendancy of more red call forces. >> but there are forces that are taking them on at great personal riskment taking them on militarily. there are units of the free syrian army, other islamists who are taking them on. and there are also civil society activists who are taking them on. they do that at great personal risk in a city which is basically ruled by al qaeda. so you do have pushback in many different forms inside syria.

>> a fighter said to you the fight after the fall of bashar assad among the rebel groups will be harder than this one, do you think he's right. >> that has always been the case. there was always this idea that there was going to be a revolution after a revolution. that is how they put it and they would put it in those terms that after they finish with the primary enemy, they would turn to some of the other groups that were in the midst whose ideologies they didn't necessarily accept. the thing is that now that over is now. >> and these are the oom quitea-- are the ones the united states and certainly europe and russia do not want to get their hands on weapons and do not want to take over even apart of syria. what is their view of what a post assad syria would look like, particularly in terms of how minorities would be treated? >> the islamic state of iraq

is antagonizing everybody. they basically hate everybody who doesn't agree with them and that will yous other islamists who they accuse of being infidels if they disagree with their ultra conservative view of what an islamic society should look like. so you can put them aside. s al nousra has a more nuanced approach. they say cristiance, for example, are people of the book and should be treated, respected as people of the book. the allowites are different, they say they are infidels and increasingly now they are saying that, they're perceiving the allowite community as one bloc sticking with the regime. if you are allowite you will be a sum soed to have a political position and that is sadly becoming the case. >> it is a grim picture, a grim prospect. >> it is. thank you. >> thank you. >> tomorrow night margaret reports on refugees fleeing syria and ending up in iraq.

>> ifill: next, a conversation about charting a different course in the world of higher education. today, spelman's beverly daniel tatum became one of four college presidents and the first from a historically black institution to receive the carnegie corporation's annual leadership award. the foundation cited her work in encouraging women to pursue careers in the so-called stem fields of science, technology, engineering and math and for her decision to drop intercollegiate sports in favor of student health. beverly tatum joins us now from atlanta. welcome, professor at that time up, president tatum. >> thank you so much. in full disclosure carnegie is one of our funders here at the newshour but i want to ask you who has motivated ou to refocus the academic goals at spelman and whether that is applicable elsewhere. >> well, let me begin by saying that at spelman we have been focused on stem

education as well as a broader liberal arts focus for many years. and that doesn't begin with me but i'm happy to say that since i've been president at spelman we've been able to keep moving forward at a time when we see nationally interest in stem declining. we know there are many young women of color interested in pursuing science. a third of our students are stem majors and we want to insurance that they can half into fields where they are underrepresented and make a difference to our economy and to our nation. >> are they making a choice to ignore liberal arts or to move away from liberal arts or traditionally-- majors, i guess, that women have traditionally pursued in favor of stem? >> well, i think that, let me begin by saying that spellman college-- spelman college is in many ways a traditional liberal arts college in that we emphasize the skills that come from a strong liberal arts education. critical thinking, problem-solving,

quantitative reasoning, communication skills. but certainly a third of our students come with an interest in moving into science. they may be thinking about health careers, initially. but once they start to explore biology, chemistry, physics, computer science, engineering, they see a wider range of options. and i think that's one of the things about spelman, that when they come to spelman they are exposed to faculty who represent a very diverse group of faculty, men and women, 52% of our stem faculty are women. a third of them are women of color. so that they're a broad range of role models and they see that the sky really is the limit. there is no limit, ex-- excuse me to their opportunities. >> but more broadly is academia, at large, i read a study that showed 90% of students aren't really interested in stem for all the talk of stem. do you have to recruit students specifically to speak to that or are they seeking you out because they know, which is the chicken and which is the egg?

>> well, i think we're involved in both. certainly students who have an interest in stem come to spelman because we know we have that strength. we know that the like lee hooted of graduating in stem if are you interested in it is much higher at a place like spelman that perhaps at a majority institution where the pipe-lines particularly for young people of color is quite leaking. a lot of students come in saying they want to graduate in stem but they don't necessarily do that, they get discouraged along the way. at spellman he-- spelman we see there is a higher rate of persistent. but with that state we are engauged in community outreach like our students are doing things like fun lab which is the brainchild of a sophomore at spelman. she her friends volunteering with her in local schools in the atlanta region, exposing students, middle schoolers to experiments that they can do in school, to encourage their interest in science. a computer science department features a robotics team known as the

spelbots and those young women are often doing demonstrations with their robots in middle school, in high schools to encourage young people, particularly women, to think about science as something that can be fun and that they might want to pursue. >> let me get back to that leakey pipe-line idea, especially once they leave college. i saw another member today that said that 41% of stem ph.d also now women which say good thingment but that they make up only 28% of tenured faculty in ago demmia, isn't there some leaking going on after people get out of college and get these advanced decrees? >> absolutely. you know, there are leaks shall did -- leaks at every stage of the pipe-line. certainly when we think about the success of women who have ph.ds moving into science, they are more likely to be in biology, less likely to be in physics. there's a range of where you will see them. but the idea is how do we create communities that are supportive. spelman is a wonderful example. i want to lift up the work of one of our faculty

members in math who has since recently retired but dr. sylvia boseman had a program called the edge program which is really intended to encourage women in mathematics, for example, to get beyond the isolation. if you are the only woman of color or the only woman, even, in a math department in your university, you may feel isolated. the same may be true in other areas. but if you are part of a community that perhaps spans institutions but where you feel a sense of support, you may be more likely to persist. we see that at the undergraduate level. >> was this also what drove to you decide, eliminate intercollegiate athletics for your students and focus nonsports but on wellness activities instead is this also part of the same idea? >> well, it's a little different. so let me just say that we have a collegiate program that was really underutilized. only about 80 of our 2100

students were participating. but we found ourselves in a situation in december of 2011 where our athletic conference, the conference that we participated in was unraveling. and we needed to either find a new conference to participate in or do something different. and when we valuated the cost benefit and we saw that we were spending close to a million dollars on a program that was really only benefitting 80 student athletes and yet we had a campus full of women who were unfortunately more sedentary than they should be for their health, that we could perhaps reinvest those intercollegiate athletic dollars-- that would really impact their lives not just at spel phenomenon but hopefully beyond. and that hopefully those women would influence their family members, their friends, that we would, indeed have gone through a wellness revolution and impacting some of the health statistics impacting black women. >> and finally president

tatum, spelman is one of on two colleges in the nation that caters specifically to african-american women. >> yes. >> why is there a need for women colleges any more or women's colleges for black women any more? >> well, when people ask me why do students who have choices want to come to spelman, one of the things i always say is that for a young woman of african descent, a population that has historically been marginalized, to come to a school where she can say this place was designed for me, was built for me from day one, where i'm going to be at the centre of the educational experience, not marginalized in anyway s a very powerful magnet. and we like to say we provide a learning environment that is without the barrier of race or gender. and create an environment where the students will learn about themselves as individuals, not as categories in another context. but and will be able to experience themselves as empowered agents of change, ready for a future without limits.

>> beverly daniel tatum, congratulations on your award. >> thank you so much, and i want to say how glad i am to be in such great company with richard broadhead of duke university, john hennessee of standford and michael-- of arizona state. congratulations to them as well. >> absolutely. thank you. >> woodruff: finally tonight, five leading artists were given their due for a lifetime of achievement last night at the annual kennedy center honors in washington. this year's group: jazz pianist herbie hancock, actress shirley maclaine, opera soprano martina arroyo, singer, songwriter billy joel and a rock star who came to this country as a teenager from mexico. jeffrey brown has our profile of carlos santana.

>> brown: since his emergence in the san francisco music scene in the late 1960s, carlos santana has been recognized as one of rock 'n roll's greatest guitarists. ♪ whose latin-infused sounds and rhythms, beginning with the band that bore his name, have produced hit songs and albums that have sold in the millions. his appearance at woodstock helped rocket him to fame and concerts around the world continued to this day. in february, he makes his first concert tour of south africa, part of a long-held interest in the continent. and, just ahead of the kennedy center honors ceremony, we met up at the smithsonian national museum of african art in washington. santana's story began in mexico, first in the small town of autlan de navarro and later in tijuana as the son of a mariachi music violinist. >> i remember my dad playing violin since i was a kid.

>> brown: what do you remember about it? what did you hear when you were a kid? >> it's a sound of screaming charisma. >> brown: screaming charisma? >> oh, my dad had charisma like he just-- the way-- you know, i was talking with my sister-- just the way he put his chin on the violin just that alone. you like, "ahhh," and then when he bow that note he taught me how to carry a melody. a lot of musicians don't know how to carry a melody, you know, like billy holliday carries a melody, you know. when you carry a melody, your music immediately becomes memorable instead of like a sound bite you know so he taught me how to just really, really slow it down. >> reporter: it also sounds like he taught you something about charisma and performing. >> yes, he did. i'm very grateful. my mother taught me about conviction and he taught me about charisma. >> brown: really conviction and charisma. >> yes, my mom is just pure conviction. >> brown: when you got to san

francisco, the rock and roll scene. what do you think you brought to that scene and the music? >> well, i am a child many of many things, so the main thing that i remember is my love for at that time, we used to call it musica tropical. now they call it salsa, but always been african music, you know, music that comes from africa to cuba or puerto rico and but when i went to ghana for example in 1971, they asked us to stand up because they are going to do the national anthem and i stood up and they played the men go, "ooh, wee, ahh," and women go... and i'm like that's afro blue from de mongo santamaria they go, "no." >> brown: you've heard that before right? >> yeah, it was de mongo santamaria in john coltrane. but they said no this is our national anthem and before they were born we. >> brown: ah, so you see the connections right there. >> exactly.

there is something about the music that really it pinches your whole existence into a state of joy that cannot be bought. that's what i love about african music is the intensity of spirit and joy. >> brown: what about the guitar? because i've actually had pleasure of talking to some of the great guitarists like b.b. king. >> buddy guy. >> brown: buddy guy i've talked to and i'm always wondering what makes such a distinctive sound >> the sound of the guitar is the sound of a woman. >> brown: of a woman? >> billy holliday, mahalia jackson. saxophone is a man, guitar is a woman. >> brown: and what does that mean for how do, so you learn to play it? >> you learn to articulate sassiness, compassion, endurance, wisdom, you know even with the volume off you can just see a women going like this and you know what she's saying, she'll straighten you out you

know. >> brown: but you have to put your own individual stamp on that guitar. >> you have to feel it in your gut, you know. you have to feel here, you have to feel the center of your heart, soul, heart, mind, body and your vitals in one note you know. >> brown: all together. >> all in one note soul, heart, mind, body-- one note. and then that's what gives people chills because if you just play mental music. people start talking anyway. how was your day. you know a real musician-- when you play, people don't talk. they go, "oh, i'm sorry. i can't talk to you right now." you know, because real musicians remind the listener of a forgotten song inside them and when you hear that forgotten song you know you get chills, you get tears, you dance and didn't even know why because a lot of people bury that forgotten song is that we are light. >> brown: it was in 1999, after an extended lull in his career, that carlos santana achieved the kind of second life that most artists can only dream of with the release of the album "supernatural".

that project, in which he collaborated with other stars including eric clapton, lauryn hill and on his mega-hit "smooth" with rob thomas, reached an entire new generation of fans, winning nine grammy awards, and selling some 30 million copies worldwide. was what happened with "supernatural" a surprise to you? >> well everything is a surprise to me. >> brown: everything? >> yeah, you know even though you are supposed to say with conviction and soulfulness expect a miracle but back then you know miracles and blessings >> brown: when you talk about your instructions and you talk often about that spirit and spirituality. is it your sense that music is a kind of spirituality? >> it's not kind, its 150% only music. music was given to tame the beast as they say in the bible you know, entertain the beast means to quiet fear and anger, music is to glorify the light in

you. >> brown: last night at the kennedy center, as other stars played santana's music, he joined president and mrs. obama and his fellow honorees. notable this year was the inclusion of two latinos-- a group the kennedy center had been criticized for ignoring in the past. how important is it to you of being from mexico, of being latino and being honored? >> it's extremely important because me personally being invited i give a chance to give voice to the invisible ones the one who clean all the sheets, clean all the toilets, serve and... >> brown: you feel that? you feel they are there? >> bill graham told me this a long time ago. >> brown: the great promoter. >> he says-- bill graham says, "you give voice to the invisible ones." you know, so like delores >> brown: you are 66 now? and i see you are still you are going to africa soon to continue

touring do you see a point where you might stop all this? >> no way it's just getting starting. it's getting better, you know, we finally crystallized what we're really about. we used to be seekers now we're finders. >> brown: carlos santana, thank you for talking to us and congratulations. >> woodruff: sometimes there are wonderful moments that don't make the final cut when we edit a story like the one you just watched. we're going to show you one right now. their interview was taped the morning after nelson mandela's death. carlos santana has long supported the fight against aids in south africa. in 2003, he donated all of his tour proceeds-- $2 million-- to "artists for a new south africa." he began his support of that group in 1989 when its focus was to combat apartheid. >> we were talking just after nelson mandela has died. what are your thoughts or memories of him? >> a supreme warrior, you

know. one that changed history. one that-- he made all humans believe that nothing is impossible. and that he and desmond tutu impregnated that in our consciousness to see clearly the victory is won already. >> victory is won already. >> victory is won already, you know. and the only enemy is fear. and he talked about that a lot. he transformed fear with your supreme joy, you know. to honor and celebrate

desmond tutu's birthday in south africa in 2006. and we were in the presence of both of them. and it was really quite endearing to watch both of them pick on each other. you know, at that time desmond tutu would say for god's sake, marry the woman, you know, you can't be shacking with her, you know, because-- and. >> a side of him we don't usually hear in front of people. >> and mandela goes i don't take orders from a guy in a skirt, you know. they were going back and forth, you know. and it was really funny to batch two giants pick on each other like little children. i will always remember his supreme elegance and conviction, they taught me, like i said, victory is won already.

>> woodruff: again, the major developments of the day: the merger of american airlines and united airways into the world's largest airline became official. leading u.s. tech companies sent an open letter to president obama, calling for tighter controls on government surveillance. and south africa made ready for tomorrow's mass memorial service honoring nelson mandela. at least 100,000 people are expected to attend. and this evening the senate gave final approval to renewing a ban on plastic guns. hours before it was to expire. >> ifill: on the "newshour" online right now-- boomers beware: social security calculators could steer you off course. our expert tells you what you should be looking for when it comes to crunching your benefits numbers. that's on making sense. and we want to hear from you: tell us what you think of our science coverage by taking our online survey. you can find that on our homepage. all that and more is on our website newshour.pbs.org. >> woodruff: and that's the

"newshour" for tonight. on tuesday, leaders from around the world gather in south africa for nelson mandela's memorial. it starts at 4:00 a.m. eastern. watch it live on our homepage. i'm judy woodruff. >> ifill: and i'm gwen ifill. we'll see you online and again here tomorrow evening. for all of us here at the "pbs newshour," thank you and good night. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: ♪ ♪ moving our economy for 160 years. bnsf, the engine that connects us.

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>> and now, "bbc world news america." >> this is "bbc world news america." reporting from washington, i am laura. a show of force in ukraine. security forces try to disperse protestors and storm the offices of the main opposition party. thailand's prime minister dissolves the low house of parliament in the face of ma protests there and calls for early elections. the demonstrators say it is not enough. and as south africa prepares for a huge memorial for nelson mandela, we speak exclusively to his eldest daughter about his final days. >> in the last moment, we were sitting with him on thursday, the whole day.